$10 per lawn???

[Mrjchill]

I am looking into starting a lawn service in Northern California and have just been told that the average rates in a residential neighborhood are about $10-15 per mow. This also includes edging, trimming and blowing.

Could this be true?

With large companies (assuming they are large) qouting prices this low, how does a small timer like me break in the Biz and still make enough to pay bills?

Assuming I need to pull a minimum of 40K per year.

Should you base your prices around others or simply qoute what you think is fair and hope the clients do as well?

Im thinking $25 per mow.

Just my .02

Oh yeah, I got some qoutes today for tools; Here is the break down:

Honda Hydra Comml mower /Part # hoqhrc216khxa/ $1049
Red Max Blower (low noise) Part # reqebz4800/ $429
Stihl Line trimmer /Part # stqfs83r/ $319
Stihl Artic Hedge attatchment /Part # sti4230-710-1211/ $224
Stilh Saw attachment /sti4138-205-0002/ $189
Shindaiwa hedge trimmer /shqht231-30/ $409
Stihl Chainsaw (unsure on size) /Part # stq025/ $274

Total=$3100

Any thoughts on all my pricing issues?

-MJC

[Sammy]

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I would take a look at the Stihl FS-85.

Is'nt the 83 the split boom ?

[Scaper-S2k]

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Some areas get so swamped by "companies", there is no more money to be made there. Why? Cause some guys will tell you..."under cut the comp by $5 and get alot of lawns" Well, obviously, after a few years of that, a $50 lawn becomes $45, then $40, then $35. You get my point. Even figuring a 50% TRUE profit (which is much higher than national averages), you'll need almost 285 clients to bring you $40k. That's a head ache for $40k. Sometimes ya just may have to let the neighborhood teenagers go at it.

Not to sound mean, but if you see what the going rates are, and they will not satisfy your goals without killing yourself, ya just have to admit that another career is a better choice. And I am by no means trying to be rude.

I would recommend going the opposite route for trial. Raise the rates and push quality. If that doesn't work, look for a different niche.

Good luck.

[Mrjchill]

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Some areas get so swamped by "companies", there is no more money to be made there. Why? Cause some guys will tell you..."under cut the comp by $5 and get alot of lawns" Well, obviously, after a few years of that, a $50 lawn becomes $45, then $40, then $35. You get my point.

<font color="blue">Point well taken. This town is an old town, however, it is close enough to San Jose (Silicon Valley) that many folks are heading 100 miles north for for slower less expensive life. This seems to be a craze that many are taking to. The growth is so fast that the city officials are trying to slow growth. With a boom like this everyone wants in on the action. A ton Lawn and Garder Engineers=low prices/low prices=lowquality.</font id="blue">

Even figuring a 50% TRUE profit (which is much higher than national averages), you'll need almost 285 clients to bring you $40k. That's a head ache for $40k. Sometimes ya just may have to let the neighborhood teenagers go at it.

<font color="blue">61k Total profit

33-34% tax bracket

means you clear about 40k

OK

So assuming you make $20 per cut. This would be equal to $80 per month per client (assuming you mow once a week). So if you multiply 285 clients by $80 dollars you get $22.8k per month. $22.8k per month times 8 months of work in a year I get 182.4k.

This is much higher than the suspecting 60k.

Im a rookie so please enlighten me on the correct math. Im sure my tax bracket is off and and 4 times a week is a stretch, but even so.</font id="blue">

Not to sound mean, but if you see what the going rates are, and they will not satisfy your goals without killing yourself, ya just have to admit that another career is a better choice. And I am by no means trying to be rude.

<font color="blue">No worries. I do not want to kill myself... and frankly, my initial goal is to not be rich. I just want to make 40K.

If you work hard everday (assuming 8-10 hour days) and do you a great job I can't see 40K being such a stretch. </font id="blue">

I would recommend going the opposite route for trial. Raise the rates and push quality. If that doesn't work, look for a different niche.

<font color="blue">This is the greatest!! I think this is very logical way to approach the situation, however, I do have one more question.

Has anyone ever entered a saturated non quality lawn market and put an emphsis on quality? and succeeded.</font id="blue">

Good luck.

<font color="blue">Thanks,
-MJC</font id="blue">

[rkbrown]

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Sammy - the 83 is the California (CARB II) version of the 85.

[GrassMaster]

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Hello:

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Has anyone ever entered a saturated non quality lawn market and put an emphsis on quality? and succeeded.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

Yes, I did a Long Time ago, It was Very Hard to do. It Took me almost 3 years, to get to the Point where I got Paid What I thought I was Worth.

I started out with Very Minimal Equipment & it was a while, before I had the Money to Put on a Very Professional Looking Image, Plus I had to Learn a Lot T00!

I Only Cut one Lawn for Less than $25. This was Mid 80's in South Georgia Town with a 100K Population. In a 3 month Period, Over 3,000 People were laid off & Everybody was Cutting Grass.

By My 3rd Year I was Most Expensive in Town. If they wanted me, They had to get off the Money for me to be parked in front of their house?

If you are able to Cut 8 months out of the Year, Why Not sell them on Scheduled Services Year Round Every 7 or 10 days & Do Full Maintenance Year Round! This way You get a Check Every Month!

I Loved the 10 Day Schedule, LOL Because they couldn't keep up with me as easy? 7 day Schedule was Very Difficult, I charged a Good Bit Extra for it, because it was a Pain. I Never Ever Promised I would do a Lawn on a Friday on a Regular Basis. If you ever do Promise a Regular Job Every Friday, You will soon learn why I didn't? []

Sell them Monthly Year Round Services, Where you Mow, Hedge, Edge, Trim, Weed-Clean Beds & Blow off all Concrete Surfaces.

Figure on a Years Basis How Many Cuts, Leaf Clean ups, How many Hedge trimmings, A few Miunutes each trip for weeding & So forth. Outline it in Your Services for a Year then Divide it by 12 & let that be Your Monthly Fee.

What I Did was Figure my Cutting Fees, maybe a few Dollars Extra per cut, We Cut grass & got up Leaves about 8 months a year too. So on the Monthly Cutting Fees during the Growing Season I figured that for Year Round Monthly Fee & it Balanced out Pretty well for me.

Because for about 3 to 4 of those Months I wasn't Doing Much but Getting up a Few Leaves, pulling a few Weeds in the beds, Picking up Limbs, Few Pinecones & Of Course Blowing Off all Concrete Surfaces. That Amount Covered the Extras Like Trimming Bushes & the Extra Bed Weeding during the year.

But I charged them Extra on a Jobber Basis for Things Like Aeration, Adding Pinestraw-Mulch, Fertilizing, Cleaning off Roofs, Gutters & other Services! Some People I could just add all the extra Services in there & they would Pay it on a Monthly Basis. But only a few agreed to it. But When they did Request the Extra Services They Paid EXTRA for it! $$$$$

It's Very Nice to get a Monthly Paycheck Year Round! The Add on Services is Where the Moneys at. Ca Ching!

Offer Every Service You can to Keep The Competition Off of Your Properties. You can get more for your extra services too, Because the Customer already knows what kind of Work you do & they do not have to Spend Time Finding others to do it for them.

Work those Customers over for Referalls, Offer them Incentives if you have too. I had One Doctors Wife Help me get over a Dozen Extra Accounts through her Other Friends, They were Sold on me before I ever got to their House. They Paid More Too!

[alcpi]

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Actually I just returned from Northern California, staying in Los Gatos. Being a lawnguy, I asked the people I was staying with what they paid. They said $100 month with 4 cuts a month in the summer. They hardly had any grass mostly plant material that doesn't require trimming. Pretty much mow and blow, and it looks good. Don't stoop to some companies level with $10-$15 cuts, you might as well not get started. There ARE people out there who will pay what your worth. The lawn industry in California as I witnessed is owned by Mexicans to which $15 is alot of money. I don't blame them, they're hard workers and hard workers I applaud, I blame our open door policies.

[louslawns]

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DO HIS PUT OUT FLYERS IN AND AROUND YOU R AREA FIRST SEE WHAT KIND OF RESPONSE YOU GET ALOT OF TIMES THE COMPANIES WHO ARE DOING THE LAWNS CANT TAKE ANYMORE CLIENTS AND YOU MIGHT END UP GETTING OVERFLOW BUT DO EMPHASIZE ON THE QUALITY YOU WILL 1 HAVE MANY RETURN CUSTOMERS AND ALSO RETAIN MOST OF YOUR BUSINESS

[louslawns]

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OHH YEAH BY THE WAY IM SURE YOUR WORTH MORE THAN 10.00 A YARD START AT ATLEAT 25.00 A YARD

[Scaper-S2k]

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When you said you wanted to clear $40k profit....most assume that is your payroll after biz expenses but before personal tax deductions.

I came to my figures when you said $10 - $15 per cut. So, even if you were at 50% profit (you won't be), you would need to gross $80k to net $40k. Average lawn $12.50. $80k divided by $12.50 is 6400 total cuts. How many times do you cut per year? 25? 6400 divided by 25 is 256 customers. I originally used your $10 lawn cut as you said.

But as stated, 50% profit with that many customers is impossible, because one guy can't cut 256 lawns by them self.


In your figures, you started with the number of clients, which throws things off a bit. If you know where you want to be $$$ wise, you start their and see how many clients you need at whatever the going rate is. You are wanting to see IF you can make that much personally.

So, you now are figuring you need $61k, right? And that you WILL only do $20 lawns. I'd say you will be lucky to be at 30% profit with $20 lawns in an area that is paying $15. Know what I mean?

Assuming 30% profit (still high, but we'll use 33% for ease). If you want to make $61k, but 33% profit...you need to gross $183k.

$183k divided by $20 lawns is 9,150 cuts you need to make. Drought, whatever, lets say 25 cuts per year (for ease). 9150 divided by 25 cuts. You need 366 $20 lawns done about 25 times per year to bring in $61k if you were at 33% profit.

Now, ask yourself, can you get 366 - $20 lawns? Can you do them with one employee (2 or 3 employees would far lower your 33% profit). If no, then you can not make $61k in your market IF..IF..IF you are only mowing $20 lawns.

My answer for that is (sorry): no, you will not bring in $61,000 IF you only shoot for those $20 lawns. It's just not mathmatically feasible. Even at 8-10 hours per day. I know it's not fun to hear. But $20 lawns make the ratio very tough to beat.

You can do it, but you need more employees, which lowers your % profit. Which changes all the numbers above. The sky is the limit, depending on employees. But then you get into hassles on $20 lawns.



I suggest looking for a niche. Or charging more. See, some people just like paying more because they THINK they are getting more. Now that is a fact. Look at generic brands of exact products. Well off people don't go for 'generic' brands. Another fact, well off clients will pay extra just to have the company mowing their lawn arrive in a shiny truck, not a clunker.


There are numerous ways to jump over the $20 per lawn hurdle. Ya just gotta find them for your area.

Good Luck, keep us posted.

Okay, that may have been too long of a post![]