Engine Opinions, Please

[Quick36]

We're bringing out a version of our Quick 36 mower for next season with a 16HP Premium engine and I'd really appreciate some feedback from you guys.

Here's the deal:

We were planning on using a Briggs 16 ELS (Extended Life Series) engine which has great features. It has all the cool stuff you expect in a commercial-grade engine. Sleeve, heavy flywheel, electric start, big charging system, platinum plug, pressure lube w/ spin-on filter, fuel pump w/filter, washable air filter, big muffler, etc. World-Class product.

We've also been talking with Kohler on and off. They visited with us at GIE, looked at our machine and have made us a price on their 16. Basically the same specs as the Briggs. Pricing for the Kohler came in less than the Briggs (by a good bit) which helps us keep our price down for you.

Later, Briggs came back and matched the Kohler price.

Both are excellent engines, but we want to build what you want to buy. So tell me; Briggs ELS or Kohler?

Thanks,
Gary
Better/

PS: The results of this poll will be sent directly to the VP of Commercial Sales at both Briggs and Kohler when it's finished.

[jrservices]

No dealins with Kawasaki?

[Seascape]

No dealins with Kawasaki?

No doubt about it. If you can get Kawasaki to come in competitively youll sell mowers.

[lclandscapes]

Kohler does make a good engine. Me personaly would not buy a Briggs on a mower. Kohler or Kawasaki or even a Kubota deisel. By the way, when are you guys going to make a 44" or bigger?

[Allan]

It is possible that Briggs makes a perfectly good commercial grade engine but if other people think like I do, then it will not be an easy sell. In my mind, Briggs belongs in the cheaper homeowner quality products.

Since I am given the choice, I pick Kohler, but if I had what I really wanted, I would probably go with Kaw.

To me, when a manufacturer (Briggs) comes out with something that they call "extended life," then I automatically think that they are saying that most of their stuff is junk but they did better on this one. The problem is how do I know that they are telling the truth? If their slogan was "legendary performance" that would hold a lot more water. The Briggs might be good but IMO they don't have the reputation that matches a commercial quality product.

[TCLL, LLC.]

I would feel much more confidant with the kohler instead of the briggs.

the rings and seals on the kohler seem to be much better than the briggs.

[Scaper-S2k]

Well, personally I think Kawasaki's have gone down hill....way down hill from way back when. I don't think they are any better than Kohler when it comes to having problems. They may start easier, but that's it.

Virtually every Kaw I have bought in the past 6 years has leaked oil from somewhere. Usually the oil pan gasket area. This was supposably a well known problem. Two of my dealers were very aware of it. They told ME where they were leaking right when I said I saw a leak!

Plus power has really taken a tumble ever since they changed the carbs from way back when. Heck, my old 12.5hp Kaws have more power than my 15 Kohler and seem to be stronger than even my 17hp Kaws. I know some won't agree, but maybe they don't have any older 12.5's?



Anyway, here's what I think you should do! I have really thought about this hard. I have mentioned it before, and will do so again for fun. You mentioned that you sell them at some nation wide stores, (or your going too).

Keep the one in the nationwide stores the same as you have now. I would make another one with the better engine. Probably Kohler just because of the name. If it costs more, then drop the electric start. That's nice for homeowners, but I wouldn't care, and neither would my employees. I would consider painting these red or some other color. I have nothing against green, don't get me wrong. But some guys won't buy the current mower because they view it, or they think the client will veiw it as a residential mower. We know it's not though.

The Troybuilt 33" mulcher isn't too bad of a mower, I know a guy that uses one. The cut looks fine. And he has used it for many years.

BUT, ask some on this board if they would buy it! Many will say no. Why not? Because it is perceived as homeowner if you can buy it at The Tractor Supply Company. And they also believe the homeowner will think so. Seriously!


Current model = green, electric start, 13hp Briggs (I think that's the engine).

Another model = identical, but red, no electric start, 16 Kohler.

You would sell the crap out of both.

[LRL]

I am wanting to buy one of your mowers. I don't know the difference in engine performance to give a good opinion. So far the forum has influenced me to take the kohler more seriously. If it is the exact same performance, and longevity, then I would look at price next.

[jimslawnservice1]

Quick 36,
IMHO no on the briggs. I have one 16hp briggs on a debris loader and where it is okay... it's noisy I wouldn't want that on a mower used 9 months of the year.....Kohler is a good engine, I like the Kaw. With a 16hp would there be a 48" mower???? and if so... would it possilby have dual pumps?

I don't know about the cost but was there any consideration of a Honda engine?? It might be an alternative and they might be interested to deal for the exposure in the commerical mower market.

Take care.

[MortNuke]

Briggs would turn me off.

Mort

[RRS]

No to Briggs and Kohler...Yes to Kaw or Honda.

[mariner]

Don't forget dual hydro pumps! Singles are no good.

[mike bricker]

I think Scaper is onto something ! A line for the homeowner, sold in the chain store, with a B & S; a commercial line with a Kohler or Kawa (I prefer Kohler) and maybe even a different color. And if the Briggs and Kohler are the same price, add some feature to the commercial model (an OCDC maybe?) and sell it for several hundred more. Oh wait, that's the model we would buy--scratch that higher price thought! :p

[Sasquatch52]

Duel hydro's would really help. I have had some bad experiences w/ briggs before. I really like kaw's but i would probly choose kohler.

[Scaper-S2k]

I'm not too worried about dual hydros. There are a few machines out there with the single type setup. As mentioned before, if the Kohler is more expensive, dropping the electric start on that one might bring the total back down.

Keep me posted as to when you will have this idea ironed out. We will be trying at least one.