200 gal tank

[Seascape]

my oil keeps mixing w/ chemical and turning milky. As a matter of fact i purchased the tank w/ tree spraying in mind along w/ turf apps. It wasnt until later that i learned tree materials contaminate a turf tank. We had already stripped the 5/8 hose off it and went 1/2" w/ elect reel any how. That was the first problem we encountered was 800 lbs of hose dragged out on a 3 acre property. the motor needs re built i imagine. i guess theres some seapage of fuel in the gaskets on the intake and it shuts off sometimes. He says towards the end of the day it wont run very long before shutting down.than it fires back up and does the same thing. Hes really agitated w/ it and me for not dumping a new unit in the shop. I guess $$$ grows on trees where hes from. I just see no point in buying new stuff when i have top of the line now that just needs a good mechanic or pump shop. You agree? Im thinking everything rebuilt should be fine. But it sounds easier to just order new equipment. the tank is fine no problems there. i see the glass on the pressue gague is cracked so ill need to replace that. what would you do bill?
mike

[McBillNLex]

Do you replace the diaphrams annually. The milky oil suggests the diaphrams are totally shot. I use 3/8 hose so I am very cautious, as I already have a perfectly good 400' hose that was 18 months old when dislodged particles of my failing diaphram plugged it. Even at 550 psi in both directions, with no gun on, I was unable to dislodge those particles.

Ok The D50 suggests replacement of the diaphrams every 500 hours or 3months. Now I personally rebuild the pump, replacing all 4 - O rings, both diaphrams, and the accumulator diaphram. The dampener diaphram gets replaced every other year. With the lawn care mixes I am running I find those white discs to be clear enough to see through, with only the slightest clouding. Also Hypro is real specific about using a straight 30 wt. non detergent oil, not a 10w-30 etc; I got to tell you the $88 dollars for the kit and the 2 hours to install it on a Saturday morning is cheap insurance. As for degree of difficulty to rebuild, Lesco probably has a kit on the shelf in a yellow box waitng on you. I ain't that smart and I rebuild them yearly. One Word Of Caution That Italian Made Beauty Is All Metric, And In Addition You Will Be Better Served Using A 6 Point Socket Set As Opposed To A 12 Point One. The manual that I linked you to the other night has instructions for rebuilding and parts diagrams. also it shows you the little hole in the piston push rods that allows you to use a pin chisel or a phillips to hold the shaft still while you tighten the diaphram down on it. Make sure you find the oil and liquid words on the diaphrams, Oil side goes inward.

I don't mean to state the obvious but you would be suprised at what I have seen on them. I have actually rebuilt 7 of them in the last year. These two companies had both merged with two other companies before merging with each other. We have sold 3 tanks in the last 6 months and still have 4 in the shopThe last one I rebuilt was my baby, during a tankecktomy.

My 8hp honda, little 200 with agitation and D50 traded places with a briggs 5.5 and a D30 on a 300 gallon tank with agitation last Saturday morning. We got this tank from a client that told me how well it had been cared for. When I opened the D 30 a couple of months ago each diaphram center had divorced itself from the rest of the disc.

As for the motor, you could take it in to a shop that does repower. Make sure they don't know you know that they are a repower shop until after they have checked it over.

Those Briggs are very suseptible to gum in the gas. If there was any gas left in this tank over the winter, you'll be having the carburetor replaced or rebuilt. Most of the time those won't start and if they do, they will run rough all day. Our dealers are told out front, when the equipment is taken in, that I won't pay more than half the retail cost(of the motor in this case) of anything to repair it. You might be better trying to find a shop that sells you mowers to repair that engine instead of a sprayer pump shop!

[McBillNLex]

I'm curious mike, how far are you from North Canton
C&S Turf Care Equipment is there @ 6207 Dressler Road NW
Their phone # is (330)996-4511
They specialize in spraying systems and handle parts for Hypro, Beam & Flojet pumps, Hannay Reels, Tuflex tanks. Any major brand of this equipment they sell and stock parts for. I know they build equipment, If they don't service it, they might be able to send you to someone that does. At the very least they have parts there.

[Seascape]

Im a good 2 hrs from canton. probally 3. I found a shop in cols here that will build this tank for me though. Cost hasnt been discussed. But...... Its more complicated now because we found a 99 gx 160 5.5 hp honda motor in my shop today. the same motor i had picked out if i elect to go new. Minus any hardware or lines that dont bolt up im looking at $336 for the pump and i havent chose a reduction unit yet. I was hoping you might steer me bill. Im also thinking the outlet hose on my unit will be to large for fitting on a D 30. Mine is probally 1 1/2 ". Should i expect to replace this also? If thats the case ill have to replace my filter cause it runs off it? Im thinking ill have to reduce every damn line on my tank. Theyre all huge. The main that comes off my tank in front of the filter appears every bit of 2". This is why im scared of this project. Any one can rip the old stuff out and bolt up new but i expect problems w/ all the lines and fittings. The 8 hp i have on now is listed @ $800 and the pump @ $838 so what would you do bill? re build? the tech i spoke w/ was impressed w/ what i have. unfortunately its junk unless i rebuild. Guess this will come down to cost. I guess this is why i get payed the big bucks!!! Have to make these decisions. Help bill!!!!!!
mike

[Seascape]

More info: My inlet is 1 1/4 . The D30 is 1"

also: D30 says- "for direct gas engine mount, use gear reduction kit 1636. But than at the bottom it also says "use control unit # 9910-gs40gi I need to purcahse both? Whats a control unit? I think i have a gear box on this now? Bill i hope im not agrivating you. I just trust no shop because im stupid to this tank. If i better educate myself i might not get over sold either way i decide to go. Thanx man for all your help so far.
mike

[McBillNLex]

control unit is the control for your pressure setting. It is the lever style pressure control, pictured on page 14 diagram 14 of the rebuild manueal that I posted a link fo the other night.

Drive kit will be different than the one you have now. Briggs and Honda have different shaft sizes etc. If you have a Honda sitting order the kit you need to mate it to your current pump. Rebuild or replace? Good question, these a durable little buggers. I would be a rebuilder, but I always prefer a unit that I know to one out of a box. The one I have used before is a known entity, the new one, what if it's a recalled pump?

Your in the middle of your season, the time to try new things is the off season, when you can stick a heater in a closed off corner of the shop, get you some rv anti freeze and a clamp to clamp the locked open gun on your hose air gap and let it run for a couple of hours, three or four weeks before you need it.

Nah go get a kit to rebuild it, get that owners manual for the hypro medium displacement pump, and you and your spray tech sit down across a bench from each other and read the manual and fondle the parts in the rebuild kit.
Then slowly start craking the case.

Disconnect the input and output hoses first.

Then pull the oil fill lid and remove the oil plug and drain all oil.

Then remove the two nuts holding the manifold and the control unit on.

Remove the manifold.

Next remove the 4 nuts holding the right hand diaphram cover plate on. then remove the 4 nuts holding the left hand diaphram cover on.

Now remove both covers, they are more properly called heads.

There is the diaphrams right there rotate the pump shaft (you make have to pull the recoil cord on the motor if it is gear drive) one diaphram will begin to move outward.

When it does take your hand and move it outward and examine the shaft there is a hole in that shaft, put a rod in it or a small phillips screwdriver and use a wrench to remove the nut and plate holding the diaphram on the shaft.

Put a new diaphram on the shaft, Make sure the side labeled oil is facing the center case, and the liquid side is facing toward the head.
Now holding the rod/phillips tighten it down until it seats back on the shaft
move pump shaft or recoil until the diaphram is close to the case and push it back into its seat.
Now replace head onto studs and thread nuts back onto each stud, and slowly tighten all four a little at a time until all 4 are tight. Hypro does not specify a torque specification and I suspect the cases are "cast pot steel". Make sure they are tight, but do not use an air gun on any fastener on this pump. "Use Metric Hand Tools only"

Locate al 4 valves, two will be in the back facing up, and two will be facing down in the front? place the four rubber O rings on the valves or in position to catch in the case of the upper valves. Now replace manifold on it's 2 studs and replace nuts. Tighten Slowly according to the same procedure, being carefull to make sure the O rings are properly aligned . Now remove the hex head bolts on the edge of the red dome on top of this pump set up, there are around 10 of them, again metric remove the rubber damper from the case and replace it with the new one in the rebuild kit. Replace cover and tighten carefully. Locate the schrader (air) valve on this red dome. Using a standard tire chuck fill with air based on the normal operating pressure you use (i.e. you run at 200 psi. , put 20 lbs air pressure in this valve. 400 put 40 psi).

Now reconnect the inlet and outlet hoses and fill the Pump with one quart of straight 30 weight non detergent oil. You will need to add oil the pull the recoil a few times, and add some more. Do this several times to get as much of the air out as possible. Now open your valves and allow liquid back into pump section. Now test run it. If pressure builds normally then send it and motor over for mechanic to diagnose its mechanical shape. Tell your mechanic that you need a repair replace advisement quick, even if it can't be fixed the same day. Remember you will have to order a gearbox kit for the motor if it needs to be replaced

If you do need to relace the whole thing, then you can buy nylon bushings to adapt any fittings up or down. just drag the fitting along with you to a farm supply store, or AG Implement dealer

Good luck man

Bill

[Seascape]

Thanks bill. Im dropping my tank at a shop monday. Still dont know which way ill go. This guy sounded ok on the phone and was recommended to me. ill hear him out than decide.
mike

[McBillNLex]

Good Luck with it! I gotta go reassemble my old tank with a d 30 and a briggs swapped my 8 honda and d 50 onto a 300 gallon tank. With that tank and a 325 callon raw water tank on the GMC 1 ton, I'm starting to get seasick at traffic lights.

[Seascape]

Bill just so youll know i took your advice and its getting rebuilt. Motor and pump. He also mentioned some other changes that steve wanted and i said call if it exceeds 700. He hasnt called but he said it would be at least 2 weeks. I told him if everything went well id buy 4 skids of fert from him so i hope that persuades him to not screw me.
mike

[McBillNLex]

Good Perhaps next winter you can get together with your spray guy and change the diaphrams yourselves. If you guys can read the label and figure out how to use and apply these chemicals, I know you can do a pump rebuild on these Hypro units. I don't know who you buy fert from but Lesco sets up a preorder deal. If you have someplace to store it, and a fork lift capable of Picking up skids that weigh 1 ton, you can preorder your first two rounds and not have to pay for it until July. You can put down your first 2 apps, and pay for it after you have collected from your clients is a pretty good thing for cash flow. They also have that deal going on pallets of Mach 2 for grub control(40 Bags).


Bill

[Seascape]

i buy all my straight ferts from a farm depot out here. it goes from 6 a bag all the way to 9 something a bag for 32%. I buy all my specialty chems from lesco. fungis, stickers,insecticides ect.. they always have all that on hand. My grub i buy from a small business out here. theyre really great they deliver and stack it in my shop w/ my lift and put my key back under the taxes i just call it in. I try to spread my fert business around unlike my other stuff i concentrate it to few wholesalers . I havent payed much attention to the application end of my show. Ive been fortunate w/ this guy i have running it. He knows his turf. capable adult i dont have to worry about. I think he likes the freedom he gets w/ me plus i know he makes money on the side w/ my equipment. weve discussed his buying of the whole app end of my show but im not sure he can afford it and some of my better ones im not convinced to let them go . If i get this particular 1 resigned for another 3 in 03 im going to take it to another level perhaps.
mike

[McBillNLex]

You know being a "hoser", I would just as soon eliminate every thing but lawn and tree spray. I watch them trying to run mowing and landscape crews, trying to keep equipment together, and butts in the seats, and I wonder when they are going to get the message. Its hard to educate mowing owners about the application side. They are focused on the 10k check per month they could get if they did mowing and apps on this huge account, when the real focus is that they aren't going to make any money on those monsterousities because they are giving my time away at $3 per 1,000.

They let the 10k per month blind them to the fact that if we could add another 100 puny 3 k lots we could make almost as much money as that one huge one. In all likelyhood, since the monsters want everything from one contractor, we would face less likelyhood of being fired, do to some mowing clowns inability to properly turn his equipment around without damaging a high profile turf area. It's a whole lot less painfull losing the occasional $50 dollar account than it is to take a monster hit.

One thing you might try with your tech is being succesfully used by a local "Weedman" franchisee. They are giving techs 10% for granular and 13% for liquid apps as incentive for application efficiency. If you can pump up your customer base by direct mail or doorhanging, the best time is in the spring with first wave of dandelions. You do need to walk some properties regularly to make sure no tech is just hanging paper on you, after all the name on the truck is yours not his.

I would also consider adding a bonus for evening and Saturday applications. These are the best times for your clients neighbors to approach your guy and he can do estimates right then and there. A 10% commission is customary, he has sold it, with no effort on your part, just take a look at the lawn size to bid size on several as he turns in the contracts.


Just some thoughts

Bill

[McBillNLex]

Hey Mike did you ever get your spray tank back up and running?

[Seascape]

ya bill its been back for a few days now. Its out now actually. Steve is like a kid on x-mas morning. I have a little over 800 in it but he built it from the tank out pretty much. New gagues the works. Hes happy im happy.
mike

[jasmine]

@McBillinLex- I noticed that you stated that you can do a rebuild on a hypro How do you know when it is a rebuild candidate versus just one that needs to be replaced. I've got 2 or 3 old ones sitting around that might be worth working on to save.