Apps only?

[lawndreamer]

Has anyone been capable of succeding with fertilizing and weed control only? Without having any other side jobs going on. Like mowing, weed eating, so on and so forth.? Or should I start out with a bunch of options then narrow down what I speacilize in?

[andersc1]

It is my suggestion to start out a little broader in your scope of business, then narrow it down to something you can specialize in as the business grows. It's hard enough starting a lawn service company were you offer a wide variety of services, much less if you basically cut your foot off and plan to just specialize in weed control and fertilizing.

Curtis

[Phil Nilsson]

Lots of companies specialize in lawn apps only ... it's just a matter of business volume (number of accounts) so that you can make a living from it. Lawn apps are however, one of the most profitable aspects of this bizz. (One person) can produce around $1,000.00 plus per day in billings ... run a six week app cycle, have under 25% materials cost, working from nothing more than a 3/4 ton van and a 200 gallon spray tank for liquid apps, a walkbehind spreader and later a riding spreader unit.

I'd say go for it. Can't be beat for the "one man show" scenario since you don't need additional help (as in grounds maint) for fall cleanups and the heavier work requiring at least two people.

[lawndreamer]

Thanks Phil,
I can get a 700\100 split tank, with 2 electric reels 300' hose on each, and a John Bean piston pump with regulator, and other plumbing accesseries needed, for $500.00 bucks. The company that has it only wants it out of the way. All used, I'll have to come up with a 1 ton truck to set it up on but it looks good on the truck when it is set up. I'm capable of setting it up myself. Sound like something you would bite on?

[Phil Nilsson]

I'm thinking a "van" because it has lots of space for some unique advertising on the side & back panels. Professional advertising all over those panels will help attract bizz and compete with the "big boys".

[mariner]

The only thing about a van, unless it is closed off from the back, is the fumes from the chemicals that you will be breathing while your in it.

[McBillNLex]

I want a containment body similar to Trugreens. We are shopping to replace my truck in the fall. Tuflex has the capability to custom them, but I'm afraid of the price on it. I want a box for advertising purposes, and the containment capabilities to highlight our concern for the environment. I saw a new Trugreen unit, a slide in for the Ford single wheel one tons. Tanks, hoses Fert and spreaders are all behind closed doors, and all contained in a fiberglass shell, but I can't find the company that makes them. Any one else out there know of companies besides Tuflex and GNC making containment bodies.

[Lawngodfather]

Jack of all trades master of none.

Only advertize for what you are confadint in knowing about.

If I was a plumber and knew nothing of electricity, would you advertize as an electrision also?

I started out just mowing, then added leaves before the season end, then adding things slowily.

You add things to fast and for some reason get a lot of calls you won't be able to handel it.

Start small and basic, then add slowily.

For the TGCL guy, you want a new TGCL body be prepared to pay $60k for a truck and body. Find a used one like on Ebay I have seen IHC's go for about $9k NPR's go for $6k.

[McBillNLex]

Actually the budget set aside is about 80k. I dont want a used TGCL body. I figure my work is better than thiers and being the Anti - Chemlawn, or is that anti christ, I sure don't want a used IHC chassis. We took delivery of 2 new F450's decked for Lscape this winter at 50k apiece, whats another 80k.

I know that makes me sound like a pr*ck but I spent 4 months talking them out of replacing any trucks last year. We had decent trucks, granted a couple of them were white, instead of gee our necks are red and so are our trucks. Nothing would do these SOB's but to buy some trucks. My reluctance was due to the fact that we merged 2 large companies, both with healthy balance sheets but debt levels a touch high. Now alegedly I am the liberal, wild spending freak of the group, and here I am the one counseling against replacing any trucks, or making any large capital outlay for 1 year. Now mine was due for replacement, and mine is the only truck in daily use that does not have air conditioning. It also happen to be the only white one left in this fleet. It is a 12 year old GMC with a solid diamond plate and 3x6 steel square tube, that has a kamkazi like Toyota Camry picture on the rear to celebrate the Camry that was unfortunately total itself on my rear end(scratched my paint too). This unmarred 12 ft steel bed is actually less flexible than the truck frame. I find it amusing about 15 minutes after someone else drives away in it, to get a cell phone call, after they travel over a railroad bed or large pothole and they hear the popping sound. She has about 550 gallons of tankage and at least 4 Solo Backpacks on her right now.

So this year ther will be no holding back, I wanna F650 with a cummins deisel, air and air ride seats, a Stahl Backpack style tool box (for my multitude of just in case backpack sprayers) mounted in front of a full sized containment box, with 3 seperate internal tanks(400,200,200), 2 with mechanical agitation, A removable tray type carrier with curbside ramp, and brakes, I want brake shoes bigger than the 235 sized tires on my current truck.

I must be under their budget because they keep adding stuff to it as well. I mean you gotta figure that if you suggest an 80k price that they would start backpedaling. These guys just come up with something else to drive the price up? go figure.

TGCl's used units are usually dogged, most of the IHC's I have looked at were going to need complete pump replacement and either a PTO rebuilt or replaced within the first year. All of the Isuzu's being lifecycled right now are gull wing units. While I was with those people we had 8 of them and all of them either needed or had had extensive fiberglass repair because someone drove off with the door still up. They all had warning lights but I never saw a light that worked in any of the 8 trucks we had here.

They want new and all red. We plan on holding these for 10 years and replacing, I would hate to try to keep a unit driven by a non truck driver together for 10 more years. And using an Isuzu or International isn't going to be considered anyway. Ours is a Ford shop, and I wouldn't want the Trugreen hand me down stigma.

Thanks for the suggestion though

[Lawngodfather]

Well you know what you're looking for, but for others, here is some for sale.

http://www.getgreenthumb.com/trucks.html

[McBillNLex]

Actually visited his site the other night, pretty large selection, and goodlooking tanks and setups from top brand companies if the pictures and descriptions are right

[ClipKing]

Revenue?

Fairly new to the site. This thread was particularly interesting to me since I have been considering starting fert and application business. I have a four year degree and am an assistant golf course superintendent. I believe there is definitely money to be made in the green industry, but do not necessarily believe it is in lawn maintenance. Truth be said, anyone can feel reasonably confident in starting a lawn maintenance business. However, I am not so sure that just anyone would feel comfortable or knowledgeable doing applications only. I am looking for a niche market that suits my knowledge and I feel this may be it. I also feel I would be highly marketable to those clients who are concerned with someone who is knowledgeable in this area. However, is this market too saturated as well? How tough/easy is it to compete with ChemLawn? I feel like I definitely have the knowledge needed to be successful in this venture. However, would anyone be willing to throw out some numbers as to how much they make soley in fertilization and chemical applications? Also, how much volume would be too much for a one man show? Any information provided would be much appreciated.

[McBillNLex]

My advice is don't compete with Chemlawn. Measure acurately, price accordingly, do what you tell your clients you are going to, and you will be pretty good at it. If they toss up that other bunches name, resist the urge to tell them that your not Chemlawn. I would however tell them that they asked for your bid.

It sometimes helps with new signees to tell them about a phone call they are going to get from TGCL called a cancel save. Somebody from them is going to call within 10 business days and casually ask why they cancelled. If the client mentions price they will talk about their product costing 400 a ton, and how everythone elses product is only 350. They are more expensive because being the best, they use the best.

Now their 3 ways are made by Riverdale Chemical, So is lesco's. Last I looked their pre M was still yellow pedamethlyn. I use Dimension which cost more per gallon, no matter how I buy it. Further, you can't tell me that a company buying fert by the production run, as opposed to me buying a couple of pallets at a time, is not at a huge price advantage on their 30 - 50 trucks at a time.

As for building one, you could try 1 way to get your first season in. Approach small companies that don't spray and offer to do theirs along with yours. This builds your volume, to get your cost down. As for pricing you can set a price list and give them 5 bucks an app, billing them direct for each round. Or you can set a stop charge with a price per 1,000 sq ft, like $20 for the stop and say $3 per k. There is one fellow doing that here and he does a pretty good job. I personally think his price per k is a little low, but he has been doing the same thing in the same nicely kept truck that he purchased, and has been the only person to drive it since 1983.

As for telemarketing I'm not sure what the feds did to the law, several legitimate companies use it. Coupled with a good program and and solid applications it works. My biggest local competitor has joined Weedman, they use it and it works for them. They were good before and they still are now.

The sponsor of this forum suggests driving through newly built neighborhoods and door hanging the just finished houses regularly, as they are finished and moved into. This has an added bonus in density, most of your clients would be in the same neighborhoods. The more time you spend with a hose in your hand, the more money you can generate.

I personaly depise large properties. Everybody is bidding them and you have to be low bidder. You kill yourself reeling hose out and in. They are huge physically taxing monsters better done with special equipment that is expensive.

My view is they are just not worth it, plus next time they bid it out, they will be telling everyone what they have been paying you, so your going to have to cut your price to get them to renew.

Let me illustrate with 2 clients, that I used to have when I worked for that other company. I had a poor woman living in public housing, paying $28 to treat her half of a lawn of 2,500 sq ft to 3,000 surrounding the duplex she was renting. I had a millionaire SOB that I was stuck with, paying $100 for 65,000 sq ft and *****ing me out because it was way to high. Someone had actually done the first app and quit because most of the lawns in this route were underpriced this badly. I would sure rather collect 30 for 6 minutes work, than spend 80 minutes earning 100.

I once read in a national magazine, whose name escapes me (something tech or applicator if anyone knows it I would like to subscribe to it again)about spraying for a living that most companies figure 600 a day is the average break even line for application companies. Now if they were all small lawns 3 - 4k priced between 25 and 30 dollars and I could find clusters, like a street I have now where I move the truck once to treat 5 houses, of our theroretical size, I could go home at 2 pm having treated 30 properties and billed 750 to 900, not even breaking a sweat.

I don't want biggs, I want now part of commercial parking lots, and never mind those 64 sq ft apartment complex islands. You also find that if you lose a client, maybe they move, or maybe you just can't get past the personality conflict with them, hey it happens, I would sure rather lose a $30 lawn that a $1,000.

I've got a couple of those, they take all day and they have to be done on Friday's, because by the time I drop 1,100-1,200lbs of granular pre emergent on one of them, with a Lesco walkbehind spreader, I am done for the week. I also won't be moving very fast on Saturday, if I can walk at all! When I say take all day, the truck will be loaded the afternoon before, I'll be gone before anyone else comes in, and I'll be back an hour after they have gone for the day. That means 12 hours work for a lousy grand, and that is busting my butt all day long. They tend to be done as early as possible in each round, so I don't have to dread them for too long. I actually work harder on them, because as a matter of pride they have to look just as any compareably maintained lawn I care for.

Good luck, do good work, price them in such a way that you make money, try to point out fungus, grubs or any other problems before the client notices any damage and you'll be sucessfull

Bill