Minimum wage increase?

[wenied]

It has been proposed that between now and 2008 the Federal minimum wage be increased from $5.15/hr to $7.25/hr. I'd like to know what everyone thinks about this.

<Wenie D's Opinion>
I think that the increase is a terrible idea. It will stress small business owners financially and it will cause consumer price increases across the board.
Who here wants to pay $6.00 for a gallon of milk?

My opinion is that if people decide not to educate and better themselves then why should they get a 40% pay increase? I work my butt off as an engineer to get a 8-12% increase each year. I own a lawn service so I can supplement my engineering income. Should the uneducated be able to eat steak just because someone feels sorry for them???

Let's assume Joe Blow makes $30/hr. If the minimum wage increases then Joe now only has the buying power equivalant to maybe $28/hr. Why should Joe be peanalized just because the uneducated or lazy decide not to better themselves.
<Wenie D's Opinion/>

(and it begins)

[jrservices]

What the hell happened to the thread? Doesn't look like GMs work.

[MASTERMOWER]

It will not increase to $7.25.

Proposals are just that, proposed ideas. The minimum wage will rise for sure, but I highly doubt as much as a $2.10 increase.

Dejavu - wasn't this discussed eariler somewhere else?

[wenied]

It will not increase to $7.25.

Proposals are just that, proposed ideas. The minimum wage will rise for sure, but I highly doubt as much as a $2.10 increase.

Dejavu - wasn't this discussed eariler somewhere else?

The GM himself felt that this would be discussed well in this forum where more people would read and debate.

Now back to the topic, there is no way most min wage workers deserve a 40% pay increase!

[Stephen M.]

It will not increase to $7.25.

Proposals are just that, proposed ideas. The minimum wage will rise for sure, but I highly doubt as much as a $2.10 increase.

Dejavu - wasn't this discussed eariler somewhere else?

BREAKING NEWS ACCORDING TO www.msnbc.msn.com the House voted to raise the minimun wage to $7.25 per hour.

The reason why Weinnie started this thread again from the off topic areana is because he doesn't like the answers and the sound thumping he has had to endure over there.

And since GrassMaster wanted to hear from the minimun wage earners in America, what better case can Weinnie make but try to remake it here.

[Woody]

Please explain, and then show, how the minimum wage increase will raise the cost of a gallon of milk to $6.00! The supply chain of milk does not employ minimum wage workers, unless you count the local Dairy Mart employees.

[Stephen M.]

It has been proposed that between now and 2008 the Federal minimum wage be increased from $5.15/hr to $7.25/hr. I'd like to know what everyone thinks about this.

<Wenie D's Opinion>
I think that the increase is a terrible idea. It will stress small business owners financially and it will cause consumer price increases across the board.
Who here wants to pay $6.00 for a gallon of milk?

My opinion is that if people decide not to educate and better themselves then why should they get a 40% pay increase? I work my butt off as an engineer to get a 8-12% increase each year. I own a lawn service so I can supplement my engineering income. Should the uneducated be able to eat steak just because someone feels sorry for them???

Let's assume Joe Blow makes $30/hr. If the minimum wage increases then Joe now only has the buying power equivalant to maybe $28/hr. Why should Joe be peanalized just because the uneducated or lazy decide not to better themselves.
<Wenie D's Opinion/>

(and it begins)

Gee Whiz what a broad assumption you are making that a guy is going to be eating a NY Steak?

The point about minimun wage is to make sure that a person can afford to live under a roof and eat hamburger instead of premium dogfood. Some people on minimun wage are actually THE Head of Household. You ASSUME that people who make min wage are lazy, but statisticsally with the unemployment rate hovering around 4%, there isn't alot of choices out there for the new crop of people coming into the work sector. In case you didn't notice, alot of jobs created are in the tech fields and there is alot of retail jobs that only pay min wage. Why do you think alot of people DON'T WANT Wal-Mart in their cities and work hard to keep them out? It isn't because of all the "lazy" people who live there. Its about paying a livable wage!

WOW, you must not be a very good engeneer if you have to supplement with a part time lawn service company to make ends meet? Or is it because you forget your own roots of where you came from?

But its going to take 2 years to go up to $7.25, so you have 2 years to pull your head outa the sand.

[clclawn]

I hate to get involved and get chewed out by woody, but here it gose.
A head of household can not suport a family on minimum wage, weather it is $5 or $7 or $9, this is why this argument is bogis. The large majority of people on minimum wage are second incomes, teens or retired people. Go look at mcdonalds and walmart, the vast majority of those people are not heads of housholds. (mcadonalds around here pays over 7 an hour to start anyway.)

The other argument some of you are throwing around is that is that these people are not lazy, THEY ARE. Listen to yourselves, do you realy think any person who has some motivation, shows up on time, and dosen't call off too often is making minimum wage. Even if they were hired at minimum wage at some fast food chain, work there as an average employee for 2 months and you will be making a buck more an hour.

To say minimum wage is set to put a roof over your head is FAULSE. That would be called a living wage, big differance. Living wage is where you can put a roof over your head, and a burger for dinner.

Finnally, None of the reasons I just stated are why I am against it. I don't think the government has any biz getting involved in an agreement between me and my employees. If you don't like what you are getting paid, work harder, or get a better job. It is not my job to make sure an employee has a roof, Its my job to make sure they are compinsated well for what they do.

[Stephen M.]

I hate to get involved and get chewed out by woody, but here it gose...A head of household can not suport a family on minimum wage, weather it is $5 or $7 or $9, this is why this argument is bogis. The large majority of people on minimum wage are second incomes, teens or retired people... Finnally, None of the reasons I just stated are why I am against it. I don't think the government has any biz getting involved in an agreement between me and my employees. If you don't like what you are getting paid, work harder, or get a better job. It is not my job to make sure an employee has a roof, Its my job to make sure they are compinsated well for what they do.

You just proved the points, yet the biggest abuse of workers is in the Gulf Coast. Check out www.dol.gov and stay awhile for some reading if you want to dispute me. The arguements are not bogus and there are poor people who are NOT lazy who are Heads of household earning min wage, but a middle class white boy probably doesn't rub shoulders with THOSE kind of people.

Also, since you don't want government telling you that there are minimum standards on your employees' welfare, then I would have to conclude that if you could get away with it, you would not pay them time and a half for overtime. Would that include not providing a safe workplace? Sure, you can claim that you are "not your brothers keeper" like the Biblical story of Cain vs Able. But then in the long run, you won't be any better than companies who send their coal miners or diamond miners into a dangerous job so the owners can make blood money.

Alot of this minimum wage discussion is whipping a dead horse anyway because most States have a higher minimum wage standard than the Feds. Go to www.dol.gov/esa/minwage/america.htm for the chart.

Nebraska and Virginia are the 2 states w/ standards lower than the Feds; 5 States have no min wage; 15 States have a min wage=to the Feds; and 28 States are higher than the Fed min wage.

[Woody]

I hate to get involved and get chewed out by woody, but here it gose.

I should really chew you out for that hatchet job you did on the spelling in your post.

[spotremix]

the only downside to increasing min wage i personally can see is that means i myself when i do get to the point of hiring someone will have to pay them more unless i pay them under the table.

that was how it affects me personnally, the other downside i see is they say they are raising it so people can afford to live. so lets make an example someome gets paid $5 an hour, milk cost $2 a gallon (not using exact figures here obvisiouly) so they say raise the min. wage so people can afford there needs, well ok so now gets paid $7 an hour milk would go up to say maybe $3 or $4 because now instead of paying the person who makes milk $5 an hour your now paying that person $7 an hour so you need to raise the price of milk to make the profit. we are now still in the same position we were in before we raised the min. wage only now were talking more money.

i'm no expect, not even close, this is just what my little inexperienced brain came up with.

[Stephen M.]

Paying under the table is not an option for a legit business.

The rule of thumb has always been to charge 2.5 to 3 times your highest wage paid. So paying $7.25 per man hour in wages should be no big deal. However, most competitive companies are already charging $30 per man hr. At 2.5 x $7.25 = $18.13 and 3 x $7.25 = $21.75 per hour. So if you are starting out and only charging $18-$22/hr, you are rapidly falling into bankruptcy of your business venture. $30/hr = a multiplier of 4x. $35/hr is a multiplier of 4.8x. $40/hr is a multiplier of 5.5x. etc.

Your employees should be making you money, and if they aren't, you need to rethink your pricing structure and the kind of customers you are seeking.

[Stephen M.]

1.Okay now, let's do the math and you are paying your employee at the current Federal min wage of $5.15/hr. His tax obligation will be 32 cents in FICA and 8 cents in Medicare for a total net of $4.75/hr.

It will like wise cost you 40 cents per hr for your half of the FICA and Medicare. He won't be paying any Federal income tax and will most likely qualify for an earned income tax credit; neither will he most likely not be paying into a state income tax. Your minimum cost per hour is $5.55. Also add in your cost of workmans comp and unemploment tax and the .008 cents for the FUTA tax after you take your full state tax credit on the gross wages paid.

2.Now take the same married man and pay him $7.25/hr under the new Federal min wage. It will cost him 45 cents in FICA and 11 cents in Medicare. He won't be paying Federal income tax if he is claim 3 or more exemptions. His total tax burden would be 56 cents and his net is $6.69/hr. Again you pay for your half of FICA and Medicare for a total of 56 cents and your minimun is $7.81/hr; and add in your other business labor burdens.

The net gain per hour to the worker is $1.94/ hr. Now the average worker will work 2000 hours/year, so multiply that by $1.94/hr will give him an extra $3880 for the year or $323.33 per month. The worker making $5.15/hr x 2000 hours = $10300/year or $858.33/month. The worker making $7.25/hr x 2000 hours = $14500/year or $1208.33/month.

3. what does mean to you, the employer? Your absolute rock bottom gross income would be:

a.$5.55 x 2000 hrs = $11100.00 x 2.5 = $27750/year per employee
b.$7.81 x 2000 hrs = $15620.00 x 2.5 = $39050/year per employee

now play with the other multipliers I gave above. If you aren't bring that in per worker, then you better quit whinning and rework your pricing structure.

For cry out loud, even my elderly Mother gets a yearly cost of living increase from SSI, but we can't seem to do the same for minimun wage workers.

[wenied]

Gee Whiz what a broad assumption you are making that a guy is going to be eating a NY Steak?

The point about minimun wage is to make sure that a person can afford to live under a roof and eat hamburger instead of premium dogfood. Some people on minimun wage are actually THE Head of Household. You ASSUME that people who make min wage are lazy, but statisticsally with the unemployment rate hovering around 4%, there isn't alot of choices out there for the new crop of people coming into the work sector. In case you didn't notice, alot of jobs created are in the tech fields and there is alot of retail jobs that only pay min wage. Why do you think alot of people DON'T WANT Wal-Mart in their cities and work hard to keep them out? It isn't because of all the "lazy" people who live there. Its about paying a livable wage!

WOW, you must not be a very good engeneer if you have to supplement with a part time lawn service company to make ends meet? Or is it because you forget your own roots of where you came from?

But its going to take 2 years to go up to $7.25, so you have 2 years to pull your head outa the sand.

Saying i'm not a good engineer because of the fact that i still mow lawns is not a very good assumption. I'm at the beginning of my career. I've only been an engineer for 1.5 years. I grossed 63000 last year as an engineer so i don't thing that's bad for my first year. The fact that I want more for my wife and daughter is why i still mow to add to my income. $63000 is nothing when you have medical bills and such hitting you all the time.

Milk here costs $5.00/gallon roughly.....if the workers at the stores get paid 40% more then milk will have to increase in price. Not a good thing for anyone.

[clclawn]

Stephen,
The amount of people supporting a household is vary small. The vast majority are teens second incomers and retired. The ones who are still will not be able to at 7 an hour. Don't dismiss this point because it is vary important. You can not support a household on 5,7 or 9 an hour as long as you use your argument, you can not rightfully justify the minimum wage at 5,7 or 9. In fact with your argument you can not justify not giving people a guaranteed 40k a year to get them above poverty level, you can not justify not giving them health ins. because any one with the slightest health problem can't afford it only making 40k a year, and you have to give them paid maternity leave and family med leave because you can't afford 2 months off because if you did you would not make 40k that year.

Minimum wage is designed for entry level low skill jobs. IT IS NOT A LIVING WAGE.